Author Topic: Enchanting system - row failures  (Read 1589 times)

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Offline Rusalky

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Enchanting system - row failures
« on: January 25, 2017, 07:54:19 pm »
I know it's almost useless to write this, but why can I fail many times in a row, but never succeed in  row? If you want to bet to fail 4 times in a row at 50% chance, it's 6,25%. But exactly this happens regularly to me and successes never happen.

The system is somehow wrong. You failed 2 times and know you are likely to fail more, because every time you tried in past, fails happened in a row. You don't craft and try +7 for a year and than you try and you fail again...4 times. Some people succeed +8 and +9 stuff a thing in 4 tries, but even +7 seems impossible  to me on certain day. Maybe you forgot to tell us never to craft AND +6 AND than try batch +7, because game random number generators are lousy or system depend on previous successes or Imperviums do not work as they should...Maybe there is a bug you will discover, if you look into this issue.
Please do. I don't think I demand impossible, it's just that fails come in a row much to often than they should.

Yeah, it's a series of independent tries in theory, but practical results do not support it. I should probably haven't been so stubborn when started playing in 2009 and another player (G1 was provider than) has predicted I will quit, because game is designed to suck money from players. Sadly, not even current horrid cash orientation does not make me as angry as these inordinary fails.





Offline Calintz-Jerevinan

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Re: Enchanting system - row failures
« Reply #1 on: January 25, 2017, 08:18:24 pm »
I know it's almost useless to write this, but why can I fail many times in a row, but never succeed in  row? If you want to bet to fail 4 times in a row at 50% chance, it's 6,25%. But exactly this happens regularly to me and successes never happen.

The system is somehow wrong. You failed 2 times and know you are likely to fail more, because every time you tried in past, fails happened in a row. You don't craft and try +7 for a year and than you try and you fail again...4 times. Some people succeed +8 and +9 stuff a thing in 4 tries, but even +7 seems impossible  to me on certain day. Maybe you forgot to tell us never to craft AND +6 AND than try batch +7, because game random number generators are lousy or system depend on previous successes or Imperviums do not work as they should...Maybe there is a bug you will discover, if you look into this issue.
Please do. I don't think I demand impossible, it's just that fails come in a row much to often than they should.

Yeah, it's a series of independent tries in theory, but practical results do not support it. I should probably haven't been so stubborn when started playing in 2009 and another player (G1 was provider than) has predicted I will quit, because game is designed to suck money from players. Sadly, not even current horrid cash orientation does not make me as angry as these inordinary fails.

This is true I tried to craft and +7 4 out 5 Armonia Sabres and 4 broke and 1 +7ed.  This upgrade system at 50% at +6 to +7.  It doesn't add up if the rate of +7ing is at 50%.  How can anyone like Rusalky keep on breaking weapons like that?  It doesn't make any sense.
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Offline ViithHeaven

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Re: Enchanting system - row failures
« Reply #2 on: January 26, 2017, 12:04:16 am »
Still better than when you break some thing with 99% chance to success

Offline Novusod

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Re: Enchanting system - row failures
« Reply #3 on: January 26, 2017, 12:33:07 am »
How can anyone like Rusalky keep on breaking weapons like that?  It doesn't make any sense.

It has to do with the way RNG is "seeded." There is actually no such thing as a random number in mathematics so the RNG algorithm has to seed the target event number and create a hash that is either true or false.

Hash = item id number + the time in seconds + family id number

The item id is different for each item so some items end up being "cursed."
The time in seconds is somewhat random
The family id number is always static for every enchant.

This leads to an occurrence where a family account ends up being "cursed" because it keeps using the same bad seed. The way to beat the system is to create a new family with a different id to seed the RNG. Use your alt family to enchant all your stuff.
« Last Edit: January 26, 2017, 12:35:23 am by Novusod »

Offline Preim

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Re: Enchanting system - row failures
« Reply #4 on: January 26, 2017, 01:34:48 am »
How can anyone like Rusalky keep on breaking weapons like that?  It doesn't make any sense.

It has to do with the way RNG is "seeded." There is actually no such thing as a random number in mathematics so the RNG algorithm has to seed the target event number and create a hash that is either true or false.

Hash = item id number + the time in seconds + family id number

The item id is different for each item so some items end up being "cursed."
The time in seconds is somewhat random
The family id number is always static for every enchant.

This leads to an occurrence where a family account ends up being "cursed" because it keeps using the same bad seed. The way to beat the system is to create a new family with a different id to seed the RNG. Use your alt family to enchant all your stuff.

there is definitely a [censored] time of the day to enchant haha.

do you have any insight to upgrading? because sometimes ill +8/9 [censored] likes its no problem and other times ill just break 10 things going +7
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Offline Vale

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Re: Enchanting system - row failures
« Reply #5 on: January 26, 2017, 01:36:17 am »
That's why I keep my items at +6. No point in wasting money for higher enchants unless you spend $$$.

Offline Dx-001

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Re: Enchanting system - row failures
« Reply #6 on: January 26, 2017, 02:20:44 am »
u guys sounds so superstitious lol its all about luck or not, theres no such thing as curse or not

Offline skiwi

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Re: Enchanting system - row failures
« Reply #7 on: January 26, 2017, 05:01:57 am »
How can anyone like Rusalky keep on breaking weapons like that?  It doesn't make any sense.

It has to do with the way RNG is "seeded." There is actually no such thing as a random number in mathematics so the RNG algorithm has to seed the target event number and create a hash that is either true or false.

Hash = item id number + the time in seconds + family id number

The item id is different for each item so some items end up being "cursed."
The time in seconds is somewhat random
The family id number is always static for every enchant.

This leads to an occurrence where a family account ends up being "cursed" because it keeps using the same bad seed. The way to beat the system is to create a new family with a different id to seed the RNG. Use your alt family to enchant all your stuff.

Got any source for that?

Offline Dx-001

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Re: Enchanting system - row failures
« Reply #8 on: January 26, 2017, 05:49:17 am »
How can anyone like Rusalky keep on breaking weapons like that?  It doesn't make any sense.

It has to do with the way RNG is "seeded." There is actually no such thing as a random number in mathematics so the RNG algorithm has to seed the target event number and create a hash that is either true or false.

Hash = item id number + the time in seconds + family id number

The item id is different for each item so some items end up being "cursed."
The time in seconds is somewhat random
The family id number is always static for every enchant.

This leads to an occurrence where a family account ends up being "cursed" because it keeps using the same bad seed. The way to beat the system is to create a new family with a different id to seed the RNG. Use your alt family to enchant all your stuff.

Got any source for that?

that is no such thing he just make some random [censored] up to make it sounds believable, hes doesnt created the game or program it.

Offline Emiel

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Re: Enchanting system - row failures
« Reply #9 on: January 26, 2017, 06:31:26 am »
How can anyone like Rusalky keep on breaking weapons like that?  It doesn't make any sense.

It has to do with the way RNG is "seeded." There is actually no such thing as a random number in mathematics so the RNG algorithm has to seed the target event number and create a hash that is either true or false.

Hash = item id number + the time in seconds + family id number

The item id is different for each item so some items end up being "cursed."
The time in seconds is somewhat random
The family id number is always static for every enchant.

This leads to an occurrence where a family account ends up being "cursed" because it keeps using the same bad seed. The way to beat the system is to create a new family with a different id to seed the RNG. Use your alt family to enchant all your stuff.

Got any source for that?

that is no such thing he just make some random [censored] up to make it sounds believable, hes doesnt created the game or program it.
He actually is quite right but there is more variables. It was admitted by GM's that every account will have different chances at different things so for example my account will be better at +ing yours at chipping someone else will have better chances at socketing.  It was said right here on this forums by either Ewelli or Ramiel.

Offline Dx-001

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Re: Enchanting system - row failures
« Reply #10 on: January 26, 2017, 06:43:31 am »
How can anyone like Rusalky keep on breaking weapons like that?  It doesn't make any sense.

It has to do with the way RNG is "seeded." There is actually no such thing as a random number in mathematics so the RNG algorithm has to seed the target event number and create a hash that is either true or false.

Hash = item id number + the time in seconds + family id number

The item id is different for each item so some items end up being "cursed."
The time in seconds is somewhat random
The family id number is always static for every enchant.

This leads to an occurrence where a family account ends up being "cursed" because it keeps using the same bad seed. The way to beat the system is to create a new family with a different id to seed the RNG. Use your alt family to enchant all your stuff.

Got any source for that?

that is no such thing he just make some random [censored] up to make it sounds believable, hes doesnt created the game or program it.
He actually is quite right but there is more variables. It was admitted by GM's that every account will have different chances at different things so for example my account will be better at +ing yours at chipping someone else will have better chances at socketing.  It was said right here on this forums by either Ewelli or Ramiel.

well idk, i've +8/9 stuffs allot easily and chipping too, socket is also easy for me too so i dont know if my account is lucky or what, but im that type of guy refuse to believe in these silly superstitious things lol, *luck* is all there is in my mind

Offline 2strong

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Re: Enchanting system - row failures
« Reply #11 on: January 26, 2017, 07:17:24 am »
My account is best in getting DCs. ;D

Offline skiwi

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Re: Enchanting system - row failures
« Reply #12 on: January 26, 2017, 08:06:27 am »
How can anyone like Rusalky keep on breaking weapons like that?  It doesn't make any sense.

It has to do with the way RNG is "seeded." There is actually no such thing as a random number in mathematics so the RNG algorithm has to seed the target event number and create a hash that is either true or false.

Hash = item id number + the time in seconds + family id number

The item id is different for each item so some items end up being "cursed."
The time in seconds is somewhat random
The family id number is always static for every enchant.

This leads to an occurrence where a family account ends up being "cursed" because it keeps using the same bad seed. The way to beat the system is to create a new family with a different id to seed the RNG. Use your alt family to enchant all your stuff.

Got any source for that?

that is no such thing he just make some random [censored] up to make it sounds believable, hes doesnt created the game or program it.
He actually is quite right but there is more variables. It was admitted by GM's that every account will have different chances at different things so for example my account will be better at +ing yours at chipping someone else will have better chances at socketing.  It was said right here on this forums by either Ewelli or Ramiel.

That doesn't quite make sense...
I can definitely buy into the idea of the random number generator getting seeded by family id and item id, but time is still going to be the biggest factor. If the time in milliseconds is added to the seed then that alone should give enough variation already.

I also feel that at least upgrading is not entirely fair, but even a normal RNG seeded with only family id + item id should already be enough for it to give consistent results, so most likely the RNG itself is rigged and not the process of creating a seed.

Offline Calintz-Jerevinan

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Re: Enchanting system - row failures
« Reply #13 on: January 26, 2017, 08:42:57 am »
How can anyone like Rusalky keep on breaking weapons like that?  It doesn't make any sense.

It has to do with the way RNG is "seeded." There is actually no such thing as a random number in mathematics so the RNG algorithm has to seed the target event number and create a hash that is either true or false.

Hash = item id number + the time in seconds + family id number

The item id is different for each item so some items end up being "cursed."
The time in seconds is somewhat random
The family id number is always static for every enchant.

This leads to an occurrence where a family account ends up being "cursed" because it keeps using the same bad seed. The way to beat the system is to create a new family with a different id to seed the RNG. Use your alt family to enchant all your stuff.

Got any source for that?

that is no such thing he just make some random [censored] up to make it sounds believable, hes doesnt created the game or program it.
He actually is quite right but there is more variables. It was admitted by GM's that every account will have different chances at different things so for example my account will be better at +ing yours at chipping someone else will have better chances at socketing.  It was said right here on this forums by either Ewelli or Ramiel.

That doesn't quite make sense...
I can definitely buy into the idea of the random number generator getting seeded by family id and item id, but time is still going to be the biggest factor. If the time in milliseconds is added to the seed then that alone should give enough variation already.

I also feel that at least upgrading is not entirely fair, but even a normal RNG seeded with only family id + item id should already be enough for it to give consistent results, so most likely the RNG itself is rigged and not the process of creating a seed.

Well I just crafted a few Divine weapons and I broke x4 Divine Rapiers in a row plus 1 Divine Lute x2 Divine Gaiters and x2 Divine Knuckles + 1 Divine Broom all the same time.   So this RNG might be true after all.  ::)
« Last Edit: January 26, 2017, 09:06:24 am by Calintz-Jerevinan »
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Offline Emiel

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Re: Enchanting system - row failures
« Reply #14 on: January 26, 2017, 08:45:26 am »
well idk, i've +8/9 stuffs allot easily and chipping too, socket is also easy for me too so i dont know if my account is lucky or what, but im that type of guy refuse to believe in these silly superstitious things lol, *luck* is all there is in my mind
You realize this game isn't floating on fantasy cloud in magic land? If it's programmed in a certain way your belief has nothing to do with anything.